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don dodge: hi, i'm don dodgeand this is google root access. today my guest ismisha leybovich. he's president andceo of meograph. welcome. misha leybovich: thanks! good to be here. don dodge: so tellme about meograph. what is it? what does it do?

misha leybovich: so we're amultimedia creation platform. makes it easy to combine video,audio, images, text, links, music, other interactive. very simple interfaceand compelling output that's kind of like multimediastories, mixes, and mashups. and that's what we've had liveon our site for about a year. where people come,they create content, then they share itvia social networks or embed it other places.

what we're movingtowards now, and what we're going totalk about here, is we're now licensing thatcreation platform itself to other companies so theycan embed it in their site as a native branded experiencewith all the enterprise features around it. and engage their customers andcreating user generated content about their brands, theirproducts, and their services. don dodge: so let'stalk business models.

you started withthe a b to c model. tell us about that. how did that work? misha leybovich:well at first, i was just trying tosolve my own problem. that i had done a lot oftraveling after college. i had been to about 70countries in the seven years after college. and had a lot of coolmedia, love telling stories,

but i have no multimediacreation skills. don't know how to usefinal cut pro or photoshop or premiere or anything. so i just want a way tocreate richer content myself to tell coolstories online. in a way that i felt itwas native to the way with all these different media. so we put it out therejust because, hey, if i like doing it, otherpeople might like doing it too,

and let's see what happens. so it has been great. we've grown very fast. we have tens of thousandsof regular users. yesterday, we had overhalf a million page views. so we're doing well. but as we really startedto think about it, like where does the businessactually exists there? we started to realize, gosh,it's difficult to actually

build a businessoff of storytelling, a consumerad-supported business. because for that, youneed tens or hundreds of millions users that useyou weekly, if not daily. and storytellingis something that is valuable and importantbut not frequent. maybe a couple times of year. so that sort of modelwasn't going to work for us. so we start to thinkabout more b to b. offer

this for other businessesto create content themselves about their brands. and there we foundthat our product, while interesting anddifferent, the end result of it was not differentiated enoughfrom them just going and hiring a video crew to do somethingcustom, exactly as they need. hard to build abusiness that way. but as we started talkingto these businesses and we're talkingthe marketers, we

said look, you wantyour customers, your audience, tocreate content. you want them to be engaged, youwould buzz around your brand. why don't you get them touse our product, it's totally consumer grade and supereasy, to create content about your business. and the feedback we kept gettingwas we like your product and we like our customerstaking this action, but how is it going to work?

we're going to sendthem to your site, and they're going to createan account on meograph, create content. spend all the time, by theway, and all the engagement on your site rather thanours, grab the embed code, if they know what that is,come back and paste it. ta da! it's a lot of steps. and so we startedthinking about well

if we could providethis on your site as a branded native experience,is that interesting? and there we started to reallyget very positive feedback from companies. don dodge: so the productsolves a complexity problem and makes it easier for meremortals to create nice content. so you found a problemand you solved it, but in applying arevenue model to it, consumers weren'twilling to pay,

businesses had alternativesit wasn't that differentiated. so b2c didn't work,b2b didn't work, and now you're doing b2b2cwhere the business' media companies are yourcustomers, and they're the ones that arepay, and the consumers are using it andcreating content. misha leybovich: right. that's exactly it. it's very difficult.

it's difficult to get aconsumer's time and creativity in the first place. to get their money as well,is nye impossible to the scale of building areally big business. don dodge: so let'stalk about the pivots. so you pivoted now three times. typically when youpivot, you think, well if i onlyadded more features, or if i could makeit easier to use,

or if i tried differentmarketing it would work. so making thosepivot decisions, how did you get through that todecide, no i've got to change? misha leybovich: you just gotto be honest with yourself about what your product is, whatit's good at and what it's not, and ultimately whatreal business value you're providing to someone. because someone is goingto write you a check. if it's aconsumer-based business,

its advertisers writing a check. but someone iswriting you a check. we just had to really thinkabout what does our product do and what real problemdoes it solve for someone that can write a check. this sounds like a silly thing,like it should be obvious. but before this, i wasat mckinsey & company, a big business consultingfirm for two years. did a lot of business problems,and you would think that that

would be self apparent, buti think a lot of the culture around early-stageentrepreneurship right now is, like paul graham says, "buildsomething people want. " and that's important. that's a baseline. that's table stakes. but it's not sufficient. you have to buildsomething that people want and that someone will pay for.

someone will write acheck at some point. and so we just had tobe honest with ourselves as we went along this journey asto what value are we providing for someone, how can wehelp them get promoted or not get fired, whoever itis that's writing the check, and how do we givethem the things that they need where they canprove the value around it? don dodge: awesome! so where these true pivots whereyou stopped doing something

and started doingit a different way, or today do you still have a b2cdirect-to-consumer component, a direct-to-business component,and now this new model? misha leybovich: it'sreally been an evolution. if you come to our site, youcan still create content there and then embed it elsewhere. and that's great for us,it's a great publicity. people buzz about the product. and we learn.

we learn from hearinguser feedback about it. businesses still use it. major news orgs still justuse us, embed us in their page to tell multimedia storiesand businesses do too. and so now our new buildis all these enterprise features around tothe creation product. so when you embedit in your site now, you have the moderation, theanalytics, the customization, the ability to embed itwith one line of code

so it's not complex to do. it's all on top ofthe core product. and it all still stays trueto the original mission of just wanting to makeit easy for mere mortals to create rich content andexpress themselves and tell stories about thingsthat they care about. and now we're allowingpeople to do that but really providingvalue to the people who are willing to pay and benefitwhen that thing happens.

don dodge: so you solvedthe customer problem or the complexityproblem fairly early on, but the real journeywas figuring out what is the revenuemodel and business model that can make thisinto this a business. misha leybovich: sure. and to be honest,sometimes you just got to wonder in thedesert for a little bit until you figure it out.

i don't think that we would havestumbled across this problem that marketers have. they're thinking about therise of content marketing, they're thinking aboutmore user engagement and two-way relationshipswith their customer base. i didn't know allthat when we started. nor would we have had aconsumer grade end-product that was good enough for them. so it's ok to wanderfor a little bit

and figure it out, but at somepoint not too long after that, you have to think aboutwhat really, really what does thebusiness come down to? don dodge: so the lessonthen for founders and viewers is keep trying different revenuemodels and business models. sometimes you have thetechnical problems solved, it's how do youmake it a business. and if you don't haveit figured out to start, don't use it as an excuseto not get started.

get going, try something,put it out there, and get some validationthat at least you've built somethingthat people want. but don't have yourbusiness strategy rely on a hope and a prayer thatyou catch lightning in a bottle and that it becomes an overnightpart of the cultural zeitgeist. if it is, then great. but it's good toreally think about where can you provide businessvalue around whatever it

is you're building. don dodge: great advice. well thank you, misha. thank you for joining us. misha leybovich: thank you. don dodge: i'd like toremind our viewers that we have a $2000 creditfor google cloud. so if you're developingapplications in the cloud, try out the google cloud andget a $2000 credit for doing it.

the way to sign up for itwill be right on your screen. thank you for joining usand see you next time.